happy gratuitous patriotism day!
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Ahh yes. That special day of the year when even Americans who don't normally run around pumping up how wonderful and flawless and fantabulous their country is, get misty-eyed when they hear the national anthem.
Also, the day when people who genuinely don't give a fuck get a day off of work to play with explosives while drinking huge quantities of beer.
Happy 4th, everyone!
For sure. The 4th of July and New Years Eve: 2 nights when I actually fear dying in my own living room because the fucktards around me get their hands on explosives. Every year you always read about someone getting killed or almost killed by idiots lighting fireworks that shouldn't, or people who shoot their guns into the air and think the bullets just magically stay in the air.
Not to say I'm down on the 4th. To celebrate it, I watched part of the docudrama John Adams on DVD tonight. Very informative.
4th July 2008 at 6:02 pm | permalink |A-Fucking-men. I walked out of my apartment this evening, wincing as I listened to the loud explosions a few blocks over. This is generally indicative of the city-sponsored idiocy that happens every July 4th across this fucking country.
While I used to indulge happily in the festivities. However, as I grew older and realized what a fucking sorry state this country is in, where everyone has their heads so far up their collective asses, I became pretty disenchanted with why we are celebrating. While I applaud the efforts of our forefathers in their attempt to make a truly great and free country, I am sickened by what it has become: A theocracy where the government has no other goal than to cater to their own narrow-minded ideologies and to pad their fucking pockets.
I pay homage to the great leaders of the past, but to what this country has become, I say wholeheartedly: FUCK YOU.
4th July 2008 at 6:48 pm | permalink |I watched Rendition >.>
Interestingly, regarding deletedsoul's comment, I had dinner with my folks last night and one of the topics of conversation was the way that despite having a stronger national foundation (the constitution, with bill of rights and all that) than many other ex-British-colonies, you've managed to fuck up worse than places like Australia and Canada that either don't have or didn't for a long time have a bill of rights.
Australians don't have any personal constitutional rights. Sure there's probably stuff about land ownership, and voting and shit, but there's no inalienable right to freedom of speech, religion assembly, in the same way as in the US. A government could pass a law banning speech in public *generally* and it'd be constitutional. Granted, people would ignore it and then vote them out at the next election. It's just interesting the difference that perception can make. The US has constitutional rights that a lot of people yammer on about, but not many people actually give a shit about, so the government can get away with a lot more, even though it has more restrictions. Compared to Australia where it's all just common law/precedent, and the government has less resriction but gets away with less….
4th July 2008 at 7:22 pm | permalink |o.O
I'm drunk out of my wits and I did't even realize it was 4th of july! Happy 4th of july! (course, it means nothing to me, lol)
Patriotism of any sort always struck me as funny. I don't know if it's the country I live in, or if it's just me being me; but it just seems so odd to me.
4th July 2008 at 7:32 pm | permalink |Days off are sweet, but 'celebration days' of a nation? I don't get it.
We have a 17th of may here, in Norway. I spend it drunk, with headsets on.
i've never felt so unamerican as i did last night.
4th of july just made me realize how much america sucks.
5th July 2008 at 8:50 am | permalink |This should probably go on the "Christian Nation" post, but for all those who get their jollies on the 4th of July–which celebrates the signing of the Declaration of Independence–here's a brief history lesson about the significance of that document
5th July 2008 at 9:03 am | permalink |I simply fantasize that the explosions are real and that the sheep of this cuntry have finally realized it is time for a second violent revolution. Then I have another drink, wishing it was a joint or a mushroom or some blotter. Baaaaa! Light up some more fireworks! Set some bottle rockets in your ass and fire 'em up Amerika! Happy fucking birthday.
5th July 2008 at 9:19 am | permalink |@becca Yah, I agree it is interesting how so many people misconstrue what the Declaration really means. I've always thought that while the Constitution is the legal basis for the USA system of government the philosophical basis comes from the Declaration. The Constitution lays out in law the concepts found in the Declaration. And while there are mentions of some kind of deity it is no specific one in the Declaration itself.
5th July 2008 at 4:56 pm | permalink |@ Larry: The crux of the problem is that the religious freaks want to impute the Judeo-Christian God into "Nature's God" and the "Creator."
The philosophical intent of the use of "Creator"—"… endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable rights …"—is to state that the rights we possess are inherent and inalienable by virtue of our very existence, regardless of whether we are created by the Judeo-Christian God, some other god, or by cosmic happenstance. Thus, even if it is somehow proven that no god exists at all and we are the creations of little green men from another galaxy, it still stands that our rights to "Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness" are, and remain, inalienable.
5th July 2008 at 5:15 pm | permalink |I wouldn't mind the fireworks so much - as a kid in NZ, we always looked forward to Guy Fawkes day (5th November) and the chance to play around with fireworks - but it really fucks with our critters. We've rescued more dogs on fireworks nights than any other time of the year because dumb-fucks leave them in the backyard alone while things are going bang around them, so they've broken out and run in panic. Shits me.
5th July 2008 at 11:59 pm | permalink |Oh look, a Kiwi. I guess I should behave >.>
6th July 2008 at 12:03 am | permalink |“And the idea of a Christian Nation becomes little more than the wishful thinking of religious-minded power-mongers and mealy-mouthed ministers seeking to expand the scope of their influence beyond their congregation—a concept that is utterly and completely at odds with the core principles at the heart of our guarantees of life, liberty, and property.”
Though the above is undoubtedly true, from an outsider’s POV I have to say I don’t see what all the fuss is about. You are up against a fait accompli
Your nation has a rabid fundamentalist Christian in the White House, another, though paler version, waiting in the wings (McCain) and the gospel holy-fucking-rollers pouring millions into Obama’s campaign are gonna present a mighty bill for services rendered if/when he comes to power.
The sad truth remains that you can’t get elected town shit-hole cleaner in the US without having your child-molester priest grinning at your left shoulder in the campaign photographs. The Christian Nation debate is lost and you guys can indulge in constitutional polemic till you’re heads turn black and fall off……you can stand in the corner and stamp your little feet and beat your white-knuckled little fists against the air but it won’t change the actualite.
Dumb-ass down-home Americans will send in their evangelist bucks by the shitload no matter what George Carlin, Bill Hicks, Lenny Bruce et al say (those sneering stand-up assholes were only fuckin’ green-eyed jealous at the success of the scam and hey, look who’s dead! God sure had the last word with those fuckin smart-alecs).
The power goes with the money and the Christian Right have all they need of both……plus ca change, yadda yadda yadda……
If it’s any comfort, here in the UK the Church is all but dead, with only an embarrassing remnant of lip-service mumbo-jumbo practiced to sustain the monarchy and its traditions. And yet, take a look at Bilderberg, no shortage of British representation in that little glee club.
6th July 2008 at 4:34 am | permalink |@Gareth - "(those sneering stand-up assholes were only fuckin’ green-eyed jealous at the success of the scam and hey, look who’s dead! God sure had the last word with those fuckin smart-alecs)."
I don't think any of the aforementioned individuals ever professed any illusions of immortality. What actually was god's last word?
"Your nation has a rabid fundamentalist Christian in the White House, another, though paler version, waiting in the wings (McCain) and the gospel holy-fucking-rollers pouring millions into Obama’s campaign are gonna present a mighty bill for services rendered if/when he comes to power."
That's what I'm afraid of! It seems that "mighty bill for services" is what drives our political system/policy.
6th July 2008 at 10:46 am | permalink |Happy belated flag pin day, America! We love you.
6th July 2008 at 12:44 pm | permalink |One thing I want to point out. For all the "rabid fundie White House" abortion is still legal, there is no state enforced religion and same-sex marriage is gaining traction.
For all their noisemaking they are not in power, the system for all its faults is very resistant to that kind of takeover it seems. Come fall when the repubs are out fully I have faith as it were that things will slide back to what they should be even more.
6th July 2008 at 2:47 pm | permalink |@Gareth: Obama's on record as saying that being in the bible isn't a good enough reason to make something law.
And as Larry said - in not so many words - your outsider's POV seems to have a much more limited understanding than that of other outsiders. The US may be a nation with a decent number of christians, but it's not a Christian Nation. It's a democratic nation where people are christian, but laws are made by elected representatives, no priests. There is overlap, but there's overlap pretty much everywhere: christian morals and secular morals are similar in the "don't be a dick" regard. But many religious morals aren't enshrined in law (Roe v Wade) and other religious morals are completely fucking ignored (love of money, for example).
As Larry said, the system's designed to stop it from becoming a Christian Nation. The founding fathers, much as they would have hated to be invoked so often, knew that religion had exactly zero fucking place in government and made damn sure to avoid it.
6th July 2008 at 7:29 pm | permalink |@grimble thanks for saying it a bit more clearly than I did.
I think that there is a limited perception of the reality within the US regarding religion and politics. But that is often the case of those outside looking in. I wonder if the fact that Bush has the worst approval rating in history is reported outside the US?
6th July 2008 at 9:03 pm | permalink |Very rarely in Australia.
Part of the perception limit is the majority of media coverage of US politics - at least in Australia, and likely elsewhere outside NA - is of the noisiest, most disgusting people. Even many Alternative Media sources are a bit blinkered in regard to how much opposition there is to the theocratic ambitions of a few psychos. The thing that I think gets lost is that while, yes, there are plenty of people trying to rebind their bibles with 'Constitution' on the front, they've not actually gotten that far, and won't get much further without taking the country over by force. The Christian Right is supposedly weaker in Australia than in the US, but Californian homosexuals can get married. Aussie homosexuals can't - even civil unions. That has to say something about just how legislative power the US Christian Right has.
The thing I find mildly ironic is that until a few years back most of my knowledge of the interplays of chuch and politics in the States came from passionately Christian people this side of the pond =p
6th July 2008 at 11:19 pm | permalink |@Rick…..God's last word to Carlin, Hicks & co?
Kap-POW!!? :-)
7th July 2008 at 6:50 am | permalink |God's last word to anyone:
"…"
7th July 2008 at 8:00 am | permalink |@ Gareth: Which god?
7th July 2008 at 9:26 am | permalink |@grimbles - "and other religious morals are completely fucking ignored (love of money, for example)."
Is love of money really a religious moral? Does god (any god) differentiate between those that have money and those who don't? I think you mentioned you went to a Catholic school growing up, did they speak/preach about money often? In what context?
Do Atheist love money more or less than those who belief in a god?
Is it possible that the love of money is just a circumstance (of varying degrees)of society?
7th July 2008 at 10:29 am | permalink |@Rick
What I meant by love of money was the current social expectation, not a religious doctrine regarding it, sorry. >.<
It's the 'Give unto Caesar what is Caesar's' thing from the new testament, money is generally perceived as an earthly vice to be avoided if at all possible, eg the moneylenders in the temple story.
If I'd gone to a Catholic school, I'd likely have been expelled. The school I went to was a Uniting Church school, the UCA being a union of the Australian Methodist, Presbyterian and Congregational churches. And somehow managed to end up one of if not the most progressive of the major denominations in the country.
The message - on balance - regarding money that came through was generally "yay money", though that was more to do with the fact that my later years there it was operated more as a business than a learning institution. :(
7th July 2008 at 7:13 pm | permalink |Wow … spend a couple of days messing with other stuff, and I'm so far behind I'd have to write a whole new post to respond to everything here. heh
One comment though, regarding "God" getting the last word to Hicks, Carlin and Bruce … "look who's dead"?! Last I checked, every human being who's ever been born and isn't still alive now is dead, afaik. Got nothing whatsoever to do with any "God", nor does it provide any proof there's a god to blame for it.
And none of those guys seemed particularly jealous of those institutionalized scamming pig-fuckers we call the "Church" these days … disgusted with 'em is more like it.
7th July 2008 at 11:51 pm | permalink |@grimbles Being raised catholic with lots of catholic schooling we were always taught that "render unto Casear" was not so much about money but about the institutions of man vs. the institutions of god. Jesus was basically saying that those things that fall under god belong to god and those things that fall under man - like governments belong to man and not to mix them. This includes things like taxes, civil obedience. If Caesar wanted his taxes, then give them to him because they don't matter to god.
A bit about death that always strikes me. There were two trees in the garden, one that gave knowledge and the other that gave eternal life. We got kicked out before we ate of the second tree. If we did we'd be like god himself. It makes me think "god wanted no competition."
8th July 2008 at 2:54 am | permalink |Yes, it's about following the rules of whatever government if it doesn't impede your spiritual development. But in the context of other teachings, it's also about material possessions being entirely irrelevant, and the pursuit of wealth being a worthless pursuit.
I can't remember where I read it, but "If god will send you to hell for calling him the wrong name, imagine how pissed he'll be at the hypocrites" =p
8th July 2008 at 6:22 am | permalink |What a humourless bunch of boring fucks you all are.
8th July 2008 at 8:37 am | permalink |Whoever said 'Irony is wasted on the Americans' said a whole gob-ful and here I also have to put up with a limp-wristed effort to patronise me….from a fucking okker to boot! It's a good job it's not important to me to define myself by posting on this pseudo-intellectual winge fest or I'd be as bad as some of you miserable shits. Disagree with me all you want, but do me the courtesy of trying to imagine the smile on my lips as I type this bollocks….either that or introduce emoticons….the site content cries out for it. Fuck you.
"It's a good job it's not important to me to define myself by posting on this pseudo-intellectual winge fest or I'd be as bad as some of you miserable shits"
Which would be why you stopped… posting…?
As for humourless… maybe you're just not getting it?
Ocker? Right. Just as all POMs are chavs, all Aussies are ocker. Completely ignoring the fact that I don't think I've ever said 'she'll be right' or 'g'day mate' in any context than mockery of those that say such things as a matter of course =p
You certainly reinforce the stereotype of the whinging POM =D
8th July 2008 at 9:08 am | permalink |@Gareth someone piss in your cheerios this morning? You seem to be pretty invested for someone who doesn't care. ;)
Look an emoticon :O ZOMG another!
8th July 2008 at 9:30 am | permalink |@ Grimbles…..as soon as you show me where and when Obama went on record with 'being in the bible isn't a good enough reason to make something law' I'll show proof that you definitely posted here that a well known politician would 'shoot through on the Padre's pushbike'.
@ Larry….Larry, Larry, Larry…you're right, I lie, I am invested, I love this shit….but sheesh, c'mon, when you typed "There were two trees in the garden, one that gave knowledge and the other that gave eternal life. We got kicked out before we ate of the second tree. If we did we'd be like god himself. It makes me think god wanted no competition."……when you typed that what were you thinking? Zzzzzzzzzzzzzz.
Anyway I bet that Goat Boy would see the funny side of being struck down by bowel cancer in his early 30s. He'd light a cigarette and smile. Carlin is probably still kinda pissed that the old needle fever caught up with him but he'll come round eventually in that big chuckle church in the sky. My original comment on stand-ups was bracketed and completely frivolous. Sorry to all the Comedy Central viewers and I hope the stitches in your hairlines dont itch.
What I'm getting round to saying about my original post and what few have taken up is that it's not ME that thinks that the US of A is a Christian nation…..IT'S THE FUCKIN' AMERICANS WHO DO!…..no matter what kind of hooplah old Dame Edna over there wants to put on it. Anyone who attempts to obfuscate me with "America is a democratic nation where some people are Christians" has probably never heard of the 'hanging chad' or chooses to disregard it.
8th July 2008 at 10:37 am | permalink |The Christian Right according to you, Larry…"For all their noisemaking they are not in power" Phooey! Sure they are, and you should be shittin' yourself cos its not about to change any time soon….Constitution, Declaration of Independence, Oath of Allegiance, these are just tools of their trade and they know how to use them better than the Loony Atheist Fringe….oh, and they have the money…and the politicians…..they got the lot. A belated 4th of July greeting to you all. :)
@Gareth - "Disagree with me all you want, but do me the courtesy of trying to imagine the smile on my lips as I type this bollocks….either that or introduce emoticons….the site content cries out for it. Fuck you."
WOW! Was that a verbal "roid" rage or what? :) I hope everyone agrees with you the rest of the day (at least). Take a deep breathe and have drink, smoke, pill, prayer, or whatever, then have a good day:)
8th July 2008 at 10:54 am | permalink |This American understood your sarcasm, Gareth :) Then again, I'm not really an American, not since America disappeared.
Is that all you people did on the 4th was stay home?! When did you check into the morgue? Get your ass out of the house and do something (de/con)structive!
For myself, I and 30+ of like-minded folk camped in the woods with quads, bikes, dune buggies, beer, guns and explosives. I know that sounds incredibly redneck, but most of us aren't. (I'm a .NET programmer, for instance) I had the best time since Memorial day..when I was in the woods with quads, bikes, dune buggies, beer, guns and explosives. That was the best time since 4/20, when..oh shit, I camped in the woods with quads, bikes, dune buggies, beer, guns and explosives. Either I need a nickel on my stylus or I *am* a redneck. :)
Happy 4th, for whatever it means, Alpha!
8th July 2008 at 12:20 pm | permalink |@Gareth: "What I'm getting round to saying about my original post and what few have taken up is that it's not ME that thinks that the US of A is a Christian nation…..IT'S THE FUCKIN' AMERICANS WHO DO!…."
8th July 2008 at 3:13 pm | permalink |I think two things here are funny:
1) Not ALL Americans think the US is a Christian Nation, I, for one am an American … and I think Christianity is a load of shit.
2) This conversation is happening on my throwaway 4th of July post, and NOT on the great big America is NOT a Christian Nation post I just wrote the other day. ;-)
@Dave A: Too broke to buy ammo and gasoline, unfortunately. I did have a lot of beer though … heheh
8th July 2008 at 3:17 pm | permalink |@ab: you're obviously an Aussie pretending to be American, cos Gareth is always 100% right about a place he doesn't live :)
8th July 2008 at 6:07 pm | permalink |@grimbles: People in the UK always ask if I'm from Canada … maybe you have something there! ;-)
8th July 2008 at 9:11 pm | permalink |